tv CNN Newsroom CNN September 17, 2012 11:00am-12:00pm EDT
over the low budget anti-muslim film that seems to be getting waves that continue. we have a brand new picture of the man behind the film, that man that made the film, so far unseen but taken during the making of the film and you will see it in a moment and we will hear from another actress who says she too was duped into making this offensive movie. we'll bring you the stories in a moment and first the violence. let's turn to afghanistan where we have seen a wave of anti-american protests breaking out in that country's capital of kabul. how bad has this become and is it close to the u.s. embassy in the capital? >> reporter: well, ashley, trying to keep a lid on the level of anger by contacting religious leaders and banning youtube so people couldn't view
the video. this morning we saw about 300 very angry protesters take to the street and tried to make their way to the embassy and stopped by police and that's when the violent clashes began. some 14 police officers were injured including the commander, the protesters burnt two police trucks and also set tires on fire and they were ugly, ugly scenes. we haven't seen this over the past couple of days and obviously seen it across much of the muslim world and not here in afghanistan. today we certainly got a taste of the anger that people are feeling, ashley. >> and then just trying to report on it, anna, how are you and your crew able to get out of the streets clearly? there is a problem with american interests. no matter what the story behind the film or who is responsible for it, how are you able to get out and report on this and how close can you get? >> sure. ashley, we have to travel with security everywhere we go, and we were able to get past numerous check points and
allowed to get up to about 200 meters from where the protests were happening, and our cameraman was able to get the pictures that you probably are looking at, these plumes of black smoke going into the air and then reports that protesters were firing into the crowd and targeting werners and when you work for an organization like cnn you have to be extremely careful when there is such anti-american sentiment in the community. we had to keep our distance and obviously when you go out in public you have to wear a head scarf so you're not drawing attention to yourself. certainly, yeah, tricky times here in afghanistan to report on a story like this. >> and this amid the green on blue attacks as well that have been making headlines. anna coren for us live in kabul. be careful, please, and continue to update us when you can. i want to move from afghanistan back to libya where the government has now made more arrests in connection with the deadly protests in benghazi at our consulate last week and u.s.
ambassador chris stevens and three other americans were killed in that attack on our american interests in ben gas and i this is what it looks like inside that building where the attacks happened. as many as 50 people now have been detained in connection with this, but it is believed that they may have just been protesters, not necessarily taking part in the killings and as they sort that out the libyan government says it was planned by al qaeda who used anger over the anti-muslim film as cover for their planned attack. the fbi is expected to investigate all of this, but the agents have not yet arrived in benghazi because it has not been deemed safe enough yet. so we are told. we now have some more information on the man behind the movie, if you want to call it a movie, the anti-islam slam that's been posted on youtube, at least a trailer of it, and now we have a photo behind that
man. wrapped up as he was led out of his house for questioning and the photo was taken when he was shooting the movie and miguel has been following the story in los angeles. what more do we know about nakoula basseley nakoula other than a lot of names? >> we know a lot about his past. we're learning more importantly how he sam bacile, the name he gave as producer and write egg of the film and learning how he made the film. >> do you like hollywood. >> i do. >> lilly had been in hollywood a week when she answered an ad on craigslist for an action adventure film called desert warrior. >> just moved out here. >> she met this man, sam bacile seen here for the first time on u.s. television. she says he was in charge of everything. >> was it your sense he was the writer and producer? >> yes. i really believe he was the writer. he definitely was the producer. he was the one writing the checks, handing out the money. he was running the show.
>> under the name sam bacile. >> uh-huh. >> the shoot, a little weird but never heard any talk of politics or religion. the actors thought they were making a low budget cheesy film with little plot. >> we did wonder what it was about. they kept saying george. we're like this is the middle east 2,000 years ago. who is george? we don't normally ask questions. >> george turned out to be the muhammed character. >> he did. >> the script handed out piecemeal, sometimes late at night the day before a shoot and lilly had in lines and was asked to come in after the shooting was done to dub her voice-over that of another actress. other actors went to the same sound studio and also after the shooting was done to record the words that sparked a fire storm. >> they brought the actors in in post and had them say specific words like muhammed, for example, and then they took -- it was isolated t wasn't in context. they said say muhammed. they're like say muhammed, why? >> she says basile, we now know
his real niem as nakoula basseley nakoula was engaging and cheerful on set and there was no indication of the real intent or story. >> i was shaking when i found out. >> really? >> yeah. i mean, i had no idea. this is a movie that i thought was never -- nobody was ever going to see. >> you were shaking when you heard about the ambassador's death? >> yeah. >> deon feels betrayed about a man that pretended to be a film maker and friend, sam bacile, nakoula basseley nakoula, a fraudster and identity thief that put all of his skills together to pull off the role of a lifetime. >> he had vision. him and the director would get in an argument. he knew what he was doing. he was playing us all along. >> in this town a common experience but the making of this film, the deception and dark motivation would be oscar worthy if hateful were a category. >> so, miguel, let me ask you this. we know as part of this criminal past that mr. nakoula basseley
nakoula has been on probation and as a part of that probation he has been limited in his internet access but do we know anything else about the probation order that may give cause for worry here? >> yeah. his access to the internet may not least of his problems. there is a specific condition in the probation agreement that says he cannot use any other name than his true and legal name which is nakoula basseley nakoula without the written permission of his probation officer. we know his name sam bacile that he represented himself to the world in making this film was on the call sheet. we know that it was on checks that he handed out to actors and others while making this film, so that is likely what probation officers wanted to speak to him about late friday night and early saturday morning and that may not basis for an upcoming probation hearing in the future. ashley. >> and violations can lead to going back to prison. miguel, we'll talk about this in a little bit. thank you for the reporting. later in the program we'll take a closer look at the legal issues in this case and whether
mr. nakoula could go back to jail for violating probation for what happened in this particular case and otherwise. using a trad? well, legalzoom came up with a better way. we took the best of the old and combined it with modern technology. together you get quality services on your terms, with total customer support. legalzoom documents have been accepted in all 50 states, and they're backed by a 100% satisfaction guarantee. so go to legalzoom.com today and see for yourself. it's law that just makes sense. wthe future of our medicare andr electiosocial security. for... man 1: i want facts. straight talk. tell me your plan... and what it means for me. woman 2: i'm tired of the negative ads and political spin. that won't help me decide. man 2: i earned my medicare and social security. and i deserve some answers. anncr: where do the candidates stand on issues that... affect seniors today and in the future?
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in chicago we're getting brand new word that school officials, in fact, with the government have filed a legal complaint seeking a court order to end that teacher strike in that city. kyung lah is live in chicago with an update. this isn't a total surprise. the mayor rahm emanuel threatened a legal junction but what grounds is the mayor citing for legal action on the strike and why now? why not last week? >> he is actually explaining that in what we have just received in the last few minutes or so. it is basically two counts, what they are seeking is a temporary restraining order and an injunction trying to end the strike immediately and here are the two counts. the first count is saying the strike is illegal because under illinois law they cannot strike for non-economic reasons and the second count being the strike is, quote, a clear and present danger to public health and safety. that is what the city is arguing and that is why they want the
judge to end this right away. mayor emanuel as you indicated was threatening this last night. here is what he told reporters last night in a statement. he said i will not stand by while the children of chicago are played as pawns in an internal dispute within a union. this was a strike of choice and is now a delay of choice that is wrong for our children. what the union has been saying, the union delegation is they need more time to go over the contract and certainly something we have seen this morning. they have been handing out this tentative deal talking it over with their union membership and then they will go back and vote tomorrow. what it has meant for the 350,000 school children, no school today, no school tomorrow and for their parents, they're left scrambling. here is what one parent told us. >> what was your reaction when you heard what happened? >> it'll abit of disappointment. i understand why they're holding out. i definitely still support the teachers in holding out. >> are a lot of parents in the
city still supporting the teachers? >> i think a fair number are. it seems to be split between people that i talked to and 50/50. >> what's going to change that 50/50 position is how long the strike continues. there is a remarkable amount of parental support out here in the city, but all of those parents quickly follow up, ashley, by saying if this stretches into weeks and weeks, then they may have to reconsider that support. >> kim, let me ask you, clearly this is going to be a complex legal issue the courts will have to deal with. when mayor emanuel suggests the strike is illegal because you can only strike when it comes to economic issues, the issues that are intrinsic to the economic issues may not sticking point here and clearly we talked about the teacher evaluations and how to get laid off teachers back to work. is it possible that this is two sides seeing issues as different things meaning the teachers see those as economic issues and the government sees those as
non-economic issues? >> one word for you, bingo. it is all about perspective, isn't it? the teachers absolutely see this, the teacher evaluations, as an economic issue because if they play a part in layoffs and certainly that is an economic issue, but what the mayor is saying is, hey, let's stop with the teacher evaluation. that's a non-economic issue. at least that's what we're seeing in the initial readings of the court documents. >> yeah. you tell a teacher who is laid off for an evaluation and loses a paycheck it is not an economic issue, bingo. i wonder if the judge will use the same word. kyung law live in chicago. keep an eye on things for us. thank you. another day and another topless set of pictures of a princess. kate middletown, the duchess of cambridge, her nakedness all ever on the cover of an italian magazine today and kc nn will not show it to you. it is owned by the same people that brought you topless
pictures of kate last week in a french magazine, one big happy family. there is another family not so happy, the members of the royal family and they're going to court in paris to try to stop the publ gags of any more of the racy invasive photos. remember, she was in a private villa at her own home with her own husband, not gal haven'ting on the beach with a bikini top off. the royal family is seeking unspecified damages in this case. inspire us,o the ones who make us laugh, the ones with the strong shoulder to lean on, the ones we're named after, and the ones named after us. it takes all kinds of good to make a family. at new york life, everything we do is to help you keep good going. ♪
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issues 2012, the killing of the u.s. ambassador in libya and some violent anti-american protests over a film insulting islam have suddenly pushed foreign policy right to the front line in a battle for the white house. in recent days the issue has been the source of heated ex changes between president obama and mitt romney. two other crucial issues getting a lot of attention right now, iran's nuclear program, and syria's chemical weapons. our piers morgan co
and barbara star on how they have been handled so far and what mitt romney would do differently if he were to win in november. >> president obama and governor romney on degree on two issues, iran will not be allowed to go nuclear and syria will not use its chemical weapons. if it looks like either might happen, they differ on what could trigger sending u.s. troops into action. on syria -- >> we have been very clear to the assad regime and also to other players on the ground that a red line for us is we start seeing a whole bunch of chemical weapons moving around or being utilized. that would change any calculus. that would change any equation. >> the white house won't say what it will do if the red line is crossed. seizing dozens of chemical weapons sites would be tough, requiring tens of thousands of troops on the ground. romney has openly called for
covert action. >> i would instead of watching what's happening in syria from a dispassionate distance, i would be leading in syria by encouraging our friends there like the turks and the saudis to provide weapons to the insurgents in syria. >> he, too, hasn't said how or when he would use u.s. troops. the bottom line on sir a president obama's red line moving or using chemical weapons, governor romney advocates greater u.s. involvement now. on iran the candidates agree, iran cannot be allowed a nuclear weapon. >> we are determined to prevent iran if acquiring a nuclear weapon. >> romney has a different take. >> clearly we all hope that diplomatic and economic pressures put on iran will dissituated them from becoming a nuclear equation nation. >> the bomb bottom line on iran, president obama says the regime
would have to take direct steps to acquire a nuclear weapon. for governor romney the red line merely having a nuclear capability without actually moving ahead to produce a weapon. in the case of iran, many believe the red line already has slipped. >> we said that any enrichment was unacceptable in the case of iran and yet here they are with hundreds of kill low grams if not thousands of material. >> neither candidate is advocating war with syria or iran. both of them in fact have expressed hope the sanctions will work, but if the red lines get crossed, both of those countries pose serious national security challenges to the united states. barbara starr, cnn, the pentagon. >> barbara starr, thank you very much. stay with cnn for the latest developments on iran's nuclear program as well as the civil war in syria. my husband and i can't stop eating 'em! what's...that... on your head? can curlers! tomato basil, potato with bacon...
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we have become used to the question, cash or credit when you make a purchase. some places will go as far as let you use a check. prepaid cash cards or prepaid cards are really becoming a popular way to pay for stuff. do you know what you're getting into, though, if you decide to use them? alison kosik does and she is here live to give us the pros and cons of pulling out that plastic. >> ashley, these prepaid cards, they can be a risky thing, still they are becoming more and more popular every day. a new report from a few charitable trusts says that in 2009 americans loaded almost $28 billion onto prepaid cards and next year the number is expected to top $200 billion. now, they work a lot like debit kwards, but there is one big problem with them. they come with a lot of fees.
athey come with an average of seven to 15 different types of fees. card issuers often rely on deceptive marketing to get your business. when it comes to the fees, there are some you cannot avoid. you can be on the lookout for the more complex fees and these include paper statement fees, live customer service fees, atm fees and replacement card fees. if you do choose to use one of these cards, smartcredit.com recommends getting one from a traditional bank. you may use card ratings.com, bank rate.com, mint.com and credit sesame.com to compare cards. comparison shopping, probably a must if you're getting these prepaid cards as well. ashley. >> all right, alison kosik, thank you very much. do appreciate that mplgts a quick note for anybody heading out the door, no fear. you can continue watching cnn
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president obama is returning to a state no presidential candidate can afford to stay away from for too long. hi ohio, ohio, ohio, and today he will be in cincinnati and columbus and it is the economy, jobs and cars that seem to be on his mind. paul stein houser is live from washington, d.c. before. we get into the actual discussion of economy and cars and the big fallout from that over seas, let's talk about the horse race. the polls have come in and they do show something unique in ohio. i know they always say they don't follow them. they do. >> they do. they do. take a look at the two most recent. these are non-partisan and live operator poll that is came out late last week and here you go.
you have the president with a lead here. this is outside the sampling error, a 7-point lead and the same day by american research group showed it much closer, a dead heat for the president and 47% for mitt romney and you mentioned such an important state, the battleground that put george bush over the top in the 2004 election and senator obama won it four years and president obama has been there nine times. this is the ninth swing through ohio since the start of the general election in april. mitt romney had been there as well a lot. guess what, a lot of ads in the state as well and all the major tv markets and you said it best. ohio, ohio, ohio. >> and get used to that. that rings true as we get closer to election. let me switch gears a little bit to the battle over china, china, china. that's thoer starting to rear its ugly head. this is really interesting what's developing. i heard what the big action would be is the president was going to go after china through
the world trade organization and complain about what china is doing in terms of tariffs. turns out they got the better of us faster, didn't they? >> exactly. the chinese were reacting quickly on that and is there u.s. politics involved, yeah, probably. mitt romney has been attacking president obama for quite some time on china saying that he would be tougher against china and that he would take action against china and he has been bringing it up on the campaign trail a lot over the last year. a lot of especially in the last week. take a listen to this from mitt romney just a couple days ago. >> it is good for us to trade and creates jobs for us. we have to make sure when nations like china cheat we hold them responsible and make them accountable. >> after the white house action this morning, ashley, the romney campaign reacts and mitt romney putting out a statement saying this trade case was too little too late and he says if i were president, i wouldn't wait until the end of the first term to do something like this and how is it tied to ohio again?
it all ties to ohio. a lot of this is about the auto industry. do you know over 50,000 jobs in ohio are directly tied to the auto industry and if you look at the related industries, almost 1 in 10 are tied to the auto industry. it is why it is so important. that's why the democratic invention, you heard about the auto bailouts over and over and over because of ohio and to a lesser degree michigan which is the home of the domestic auto industry. >> this is an spg dovetail for rom. if he thought he was taking it on the chin a bit over foreign policy last week and wanted to take a right turn and get back to the economy, he does very well staying on the economy. this is a way to take foreign policy in china and make it the economy. >> i guess you're right, to try to pivot foreign policy back to domestic issues and that is what you are seeing this week from the romney campaign and seeing maybe i guess you could say not a back to basics because they still will be hit ago lot of issues but there you go, one of the brand new ad from mitt romney, two new ads in the battleground states and beet on the economy and one lays out what mitt romney would do and
how he would help the middle class and the other attacks president obama for his policies and what the romney campaign says how they hurt the middle class. i was on a conference call and they say the romney campaign says they to want get back to specifics >> campaigning is a lot like mental gymnastics with foreign hurdles being thrown at you. thanks so much. nice to see you. the president is due to speak at about 12:25 eastern time, and you're going to see him live on cnn. governor romney for his part is in los angeles today for a speech to the united states hispanic chamber of commerce. you will be seeing that. his schedule has 3:15 p.m. eastern time, that's 12:15 pacific time. make sure you stay tuned. there are a lot of warning lights
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coverups. the los angeles times got ahold of confidential files known as the per version files. let's go to straight to one of the l.a. times reporters digging into the story. jason phelps joins us now on the phone. jason, this is just astounding to hear the headline on this. first of all, what is in these files and how are these kept quiet for so long? >> the boy scouts of america has been keeping per version files for almost 100 years. it is a confidential record of men accused of sexual abuse and they have been stored away and filing cabinets in boy scouts headquarters for all of that time and they have become to come out in different lawsuits over the years and we were able to obtain about 1800 of them and we have gotten through about 1,600 so far and contain a very detailed accounting of how the boy scouts dealt with allegations when they arose, who
they contacted, a lot of back and forth between local officials and the national office about what to do about the allegation sdps we found in the 500 cases where the boy scouts were the first to become aware of allegations of sexual abuse, 80% of those cases contain no indication that they were reported to authorities and 100 of them have over references to efforts to keep that information, keep the abuse from parents, from the public, and from law enforcement. >> there is so many levels on which that is just extraordinarily distressing, moral, legal, everything, and i do want to read out for you a statement that has been given to company by the boy scouts of america and it reads we regret there are have been times when despite the best efforts to protect children scouts were abused and for that we are very sorry. we have always cooperated fully with law enforcement and now require our members to report even suspicion of abuse directly
to local law enforcement. recent media reports looked athe a subset of the boy scouts of america's ineligible volunteer files from approximately 40 years ago when the boy scouts of america served approximately 5 million young people each year. my question would not ineligible aspect of that statement, jason. what does that mean when the boy scouts say the files that you have and presumably they're suggesting you and they say media reports ineligible volunteer files. >> that's a reference -- that's what they have come to call the perversion files in more recent years, inhe will vibl volunteers because men accused of sexual abuse were banned from scouting for life, and what didn't always happen was that these men were reported to law enforcement and faced their day in court, and so
what's begun to happen is that these files have come to light and they're being scrutinized. it is true many of these files are very old, some 34 years old. we would welcome the opportunity to examine more recent files. the boy scouts of america is fighting very actively in court across the country to prevent the release of more recent files and so -- >> i am confused. i have not had a chance to read these files. full disclosure, i am just trying to get notes on your reporting of it and there is a case about someone named arthur humphrey that is can shed light. seemed to me that these are not volunteer files where people were ineligible but that in some cases if people left of their own volition, that was one instance. they may have been fired and in certain cases some were allowed to remain for years in fact with the boy scouts. >> and mr. humphries is one in point. in 1978 a scout executive in
virginia received very detailed reports that art humphries, a highly decorated scout smaster who received presidential citations and scouting's highest honor, the silver beaver badge, that mr. humphries had been molesting children in the scouts. those allegations were not taken to police, and mr. humphries was not expelled from the scouts. he was allowed to continue in the scouts and the same executive two years after receiving the detailed reports gave mr. humphries a glowing recommendation for a job within the scouts at an upcoming event. it was only in 1984, several years later, that police caught mr. humphries and he eventually pled guilty to sodomizing 20 boys and was sentenced to 151 years. >> so, jason, i have to wrap this up. is there evidence you have uncovered that people listed as accused or alleged sex offenders within the boy scouts went on to
molest other children outside of the boy scouts years later? >> yeah. there is ample evidence of that. mr. humphries again is a case in point. after the boy scouts were aware of his sexual abuse of children within the scouts, he went on to molest five additional boys in scouting. there is other cases we write about in the story in which men are expelled from scouts but no one is told about it and they go onto molest other boys in the community. so the clear by-product of covering up these cases is that these men were allowed to continue their activity. >> reporting for us from the los angeles times. thank you for that. also, these details clearly raise a lot of questions, not the least of which the potential lawsuits, the fall out from this. we'll get perspective from one of our best legal experts in just a moment. urizer do that? [ female announcer ] dermatologist recommended aveeno has an oat formula, now proven to build a moisture reserve, so skin can replenish itself. that's healthy skin for life. only from aveeno.
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vaet records of hundreds of alleged child molesters within the ranks of the boy scouts of america. seems they not only worked for the boy scouts, they were allegedly protected by the leaders, the crimes kept secret and the tracks covered up. some of the stunning allegations have been uncovered by the los angeles times after it reviewed 1,600 confidential files, records that were known as, quote, the per dlgs version files and in them case after case of volunteers and employees allegedly raping and molesting scouts year after year, decade after decade. it certainly does raise a lot of legal questions, at the very least the legal questions, certainly the moral questions go without mention. defense attorney joey jackson is here to give us some of the legal perspective on this. first of all, where do i start? obstruction of justice, civil cases, and you start with what you think is the most critical legal aspect of the boy scouts may be facing at this point. >> there are several.
we know that the boy scouts do a lot of good for sure. they help a lot of people and i don't mean to cast gate them by any means. when you have things like this, it is difficult to talk about. there are a couple of things that come to mind. the first as you're mentioning relates to criminal prosecutions. whenever anything is covered up, particularly something of this magnitude, when it affects children, their welfare, their well-being, criminal prosecutions are certainly something you have to look at because they're paramount here in addition to any criminal prosecution, of course, you have the civil factor. what do i mean? i mean money and damages. >> before we get to the money, we have heard this before with penn state, bring your wheel barrel for the money the organization will owe you after the ugly mess. talk about criminal for starters. a lot of people are under the understanding organizations have a duty to report dangers when it comes to children. are there any states exempt from that? >> no. what ends up happening is on the federal law and under state law, state laws may vary with regard
to how it is reported, the time frame in which you have to report it and if there is anything where in you would suspect that child abuse is occurring and it is credible, it is not that you have a sneaking suspicion that you can't justify or you think or might imagine, but if there is something credible that you might believe relates to a child, a child in danger, a child's welfare, you have a duty irrespective of the state in which you live to provide that information to authorities so that there actio it, and, in fact, as it relates to the federal government, the federal government to their credit in 2010 passed the statute actually dealing with this specifically, dealing with -- >> 2010? >> yes, i know. >> 2010? >> it was amended a number of times. >> i know. >> we're talking 1970s the beginning of this ugly can of worms. >> it's late in the game, but what they did -- it was amended and passed previous to that. just in terms of appoint aing guardian ad litem and what that person does -- >> someone who represents the kids. >> exactly. it's a kid's attorney to go and look at it and to see what the dangers are. if the threat was credible, if
anything happened, what we could do to provide for the psychological welfare and well being of the child. >> but protecting alleged abusers, allowing them to stay on staff, allowing them to perhaps escape unscathed to want to abuse other children outside the boy scouts? >> what ends up happening, whenever you talk about documents and records, of course, there are some previous si issues that need to be addressed. however, what you have to do is measure the privacy interests of the people who are employees versus the interests of the actual victim, and when it relates to the victim, those interests are paramount because we need to get the information to address and resolve these issues. >> how about the victim and then the potential future victims as well? joey jackson, hold those thoughts for a moment. i have more that i need to ask you. thank you for that. in the meantime, dow want you to know that the boy scouts of america has issued a statement to cnn, and let me read for you.
in part it says in the more than 100 years that the boy scouts of america has served youth society has learned about this important issue. the boy scouts of america continuously enhanced its multi-tiered policies and procedures which now include background checks, comprehensive training programs, and safety policies. wow... [ female announcer ] sometimes, all you need is the smooth, creamy taste of werther's original caramel to remind you that you're someone very special. ♪ now discover new caramel apple filled werther's original.
in california a controversial anti-muslim filmmaker is in hiding. no surprise. it's not the first he has had some serious trouble with the law. we found court documents that show that this man has used at least 17 different names during his lifetime. names like sam bassille and p.j. tobacco. not a robing.
here's something you may not have known. in 1997 he spent a year in prison for intent to manufacture methamphetamines. then he was convicted of credit card fraud and identity theft. >> he has been banned from using the internet. let's talk about the m and the trailer that was on youtube. somebody had to put that trailer on youtube. >> without question. >> if it's mr. bassely who put this, he would have had to have used the internet, and that would be a violation of? >> his probation. >> huh oh. >> it could be problematic. here's what they're going to look at. certainly they'll look at probation and what the requirements are. as you point out, you can't use the internet. the question will be whether that was really designed for the bank fraud issue. many times people use the internet to do pretty tough
things about other people, and, therefore, was that the intent of the probation to make sure that he didn't do anything of a criminal variety as it related to internet use and bank fraud. not necessarily producing the movie. the other thing is that perhaps he didn't do it, someone else, a surrogate, was the person who actually put it on the internet and then actually we do know, of course, that one thing that was a probation violation if he did was use false names, which has a prior history of doing that. he did it here. >> we already know his name is nakoula bassely nakoula, but he on the movie named him as sam bassel. >> therefore, it would be a potential violation. was it so that, meaning the use of these names to engage in fraudulent activity, because there are a lot of people that produce films and write books quite frankly who use other names. >> is the probation officer going to like this and has just found out about it from watching us and gets mad about it? does he go back in the pokey for three years? >> what ends up happening is the judge -- he will be brought back
to the judge, and the defense attorney will make arguments that, you know what, your honor, he was engaged in a lawful activity that was creating a film. he was engaged in artistic expression and therefore, he shouldn't be held criminally responsible. the prosecutors will have a lot to say about that with regard to the potential use of the internet and the use of these names, and if the judge feels that it is a violation, not so much a technical violation, but, you know, a substantive and material violation of his probation violation, guess where he ends up? >> pokey. >> yes, he does. >> these actors and actresses are very upset, and many of them have said they have no idea they were duped. they were asked to come back and loop audio that said mohammed who is could be a super imposed over what they originally said. they had no idea they said that this was going to be the movie it was. is there a case to be made -- >> the first thing is that we have a lot to do with artistic expression. we value it. we value the first amendment,
and, therefore, we allow producers and makers much films to represent on film what they like. the other issue is freedom of contract. a lot of times actors waive rights to lawsuits. however, you hit the nail on the head, ashley. were they duped to otherwise fraudulently induce into entering into this picture, thereby really without their consent. they signed away their rights, of course, with regard to making a film, but did they know it would be of this variety? it's a tough argument to make. why? because of foreseeability. certainly you don't anticipate that there are going to be mass killings. there are a lot of films, of course, that depict pretty negative things. based upon that, though, people voice objections. they don't necessarily kill people. >> yeah. well, foreseeability. you can ask salamon rushdy about that. we have precedent based on these kinds of things where you can know what might happen. just quickly, five seconds. do you think they have his hard drive? >> i know they have his hard drive. >> hard drive. >> the feds investigate. >> i knew you would have the answers. you'll have to it stay on this with me because i'm fascinated to find out what's going